Crab vs dental floss

Questions about designing a terrarium.
Rich
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Re: Crab vs dental floss

Post by Rich »

Hi
I believe the purpose of the scent antenae is to reach out and touch whever particles are causing scent. Unlike a human nose which can vacume in large numbers of particles, the crab's modified gills probably don't have much intake force and even if they did, the scent-sensors aren't probably in the right place to benefit from it. So they have to sweep around.

The point I'm making is that while there may be some amount of choice vs instinct in where and what the crab does with it's scent feelers, it is probably only concerned with gathering data.

Gathering data has nothing to do with using these antenas like signal flags to communicate. It could, of course. It does appear to be one of the most "expressive" or articulatable appendages on the crab.

But I think it just indicates scent processing. For instance when two crabs wave at each other, they are just confirming via scent who they are looking at. Not making plans for the evening.

This in itself tells something about the internal state of the crab and may be the first step in understanding their internal state. It's easy enough to see the difference between a sleeping crab and an alert crab by the sheer activity of their antenae.

Taking it a step further, is there a repetoire of movements to the antenae? For instance do they react one way to bitter smells, another way to sour? They might have a simple language going. Even if they produce statements unintentionally, it might reflect accurately what they are thinking and feelng. If so, they can't hide their true feelings from each other. That would be nice, since they are heavily armed creatures and it would be good for them to know who is their true friend.
crypticlaman
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Re: Crab vs dental floss

Post by crypticlaman »

I suppose theoretically there is no way for this sense organ to double as a comunicative device in the crabs, of course a few hundred years ago it was theoretically impossible for a bee to relate to its fellow bees down to the decimeter the location of pollen across miles of winding flight patterns by simply shaking its but, impossible for dolphins to communicate through a type of wavelength we superfluously superior humans couldnt pick up with our sense organs alone, and definitely impossible for a mindless gorrilla to comunicate with sign language or even for an african grey to learn thousands of words including colors and material makeups of his "toys"...

Being a druid I am not on top of the animal totem pole. I see emotion and thought...I ponder. I agree it is theoretically impossible there is communication in what i see and it is probably natural human personification for species survival and a feeling of belonging...but then again which of these afforementioned animal characteristics wasnt just as theoretically impossible, and how many observers were shot down before the right observer wrote it in an article, a textbook, or a research paper for all of us to see?...

something to think about
Rich
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Re: Crab vs dental floss

Post by Rich »

For the second time, she stroked my finger like she strokes her favorite toy. THIS is amatuer xenolinguistics at its best.
Rich
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Re: Crab vs dental floss

Post by Rich »

Perhaps "rewarding" would be a better term than "best."

:)
CrabbyJo
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Re: Crab vs dental floss

Post by CrabbyJo »

Rich,
I'm loving the detailed experiences of your experimentation in xenolinguistics with your crab. Please do keep sharing, you are definitely helping to open my eyes up to my own crabs, who have been largely neglected socially for some months now, as life has been very busy for me.

I recall reading something about a year ago - a poster on a forum had noticed one of her crabs spending a lot of time in one spot, completely away from the area he usually preferred, and she got the sense that something was amiss. It just didn't seem right. After a couple of days of this I think it was, she realized that one of her other crabs was sitting in I think a wooden tank ornament, and the owner thought the crab was just sleeping or basking. Then she realized that the crab in the wood was actually wedged in and could not get out. She freed him, and was astounded that the first crab mentioned had apparently shown empathy for the other crab, causing her to give her attention to him.

I have also shared email with another woman who is disabled. She spoke to me of taking her crab out and carrying her around on her bathrobe, and the crab would snuggle down and sleep in the crook of her arm on her bathrobe as she sat and read a book. She would hold the crab up and give her kisses, and the crab would gently push back with her legs with each kiss. She said she could hear little popping noises when she had the crab close, and felt certain she was talking to her in crabby language. My skeptical mind - always looking for logical explanations - thought perhaps it was the sound of bubbles on the crab's gills, but without being able to truly talk with this woman or see her crab, I can't say. I just know, it's amazing what we may be missing because we have the attitude that these creatures do not have emotion like humans, or mammals.
The definitely have personalities.
6 hermit crabs - 3 PPs and 3 Equadorians
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Rich
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Re: Crab vs dental floss

Post by Rich »

Crabby Jo

I believe you were correct when you said the crab was irritated by my teasing with the dental floss and might associate dislike with me.

She has gained the new habit of darting her head in and out of her shell several times when she sees me. I find this displeasing aesthetically and my impression is that she is trying to express displeasure or dislike of me.

Also she spends more time hiding and doesn't give me the "open faced" look that I enjoy so much. It's more like a partially concealled/withdrawn "new jersey streetfighter" look.

We live and learn.
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ladybug15057
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Re: Crab vs dental floss

Post by ladybug15057 »

I'm sorry to hear your little one is upset with you. Usually when they jump back in their shells it also can mean they are afraid. Now it sounds like it maybe time to make up?
Marie (aka ladybug15057)

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Rich
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Re: Crab vs dental floss

Post by Rich »

Things Azazul loves:

1) Knocking down all the seashells that I balance on the gnarly climbing branches. Twice a day. This has nothing to do with needing space. She reaches way out, knocks them down then goes the other way.

2) Baby food of all flavors

3) The 'cut out' bottom of a plastic water bottle: Just the right thickness and consistancy for long pinching sessions. Noisy and durable too.

4) White chicken cartilage from the backbone: Once she held it up with both claws as if to say "You know what it means when I do this?"

5) Friendly eye contact

6) Being waved at slowly

7) Sitting on lettuce, facing away from it preferably. I think this is because the lettuce is cold from the refrigerator.

8) a mirror, especially outside the aquarium where she cannot try to climb it to freedom.

9) Dreaming of escape. She wants it so bad that even I have dreams of a little crab with eyelashes apologizing for her inability to stop from disappearing into the wild.

10) Nice moist play sand.

11) Taking a seashell home to her tunnel or a cave and sleeping next to it.

12) Making a cave for fun, not for molting. Only did that once. I wonder why.

13) Moving the biggest furniture she owns. Strenuously. Hasn't done that lately.

14) Being breathed on as a gesture of introduction


Hates:
1) Being picked up or touched
2) Perfume (?) I think the alcohol stings her. She darted away from my girlfriend once.
3) That darn water spray



Doesn't seem to notice or have an opinion either way about:
1) Canned shrimp or crickets intended for salamanders.
2) Falling as a means of transportation.



Other activities, uncertain how she feels about but probably wants:
1) Climbing upside down and rattling the screen cover of the aquarium for hours if she can come in contact with it. Sort of like an imprisoned monkey. Upsetting to watch and listen to.

2) Going for a march on the floor. You have to put your head down next to her or she won't do it.
Rich
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Re: Crab vs dental floss

Post by Rich »

Anyway. What I learned from this is that there's a certain amount of personal interaction that my crab could tolerate. She obviously didn't like the dental floss. There is a big difference now, she is obviouslly agitated and uncomfortable when she see's me near. Previously, she gave an impression that was quite different.
CrabbyJo
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Re: Crab vs dental floss

Post by CrabbyJo »

Interesting observations.
Keep in mind also that crabs will seem to change personalities too, depending on whether they are pre or post molt, or who knows why else?
I had a crab who was always out and about, climbing and digging, you could always count on him being out. Then he had a couple of molts, and it seems he's changed pretty much completely. He will still be out and not be afraid, but he isn't out and exploring and napping all over in the vines and leaves any more. This is behavior observed over about a year. It is tempting to draw conclusions from a few weeks of observation, but keep an open mind. Don't come to conclusions, and always believe that there may be something that we as humans are missing, and might realize later on. :)
6 hermit crabs - 3 PPs and 3 Equadorians
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Please feel free to share information from this website, but please be sure to give credit and a link back to the information. Failure to give credit is plagiarism. Don't take credit for someone else's information.
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